Hbp - What Did You Think?, Spoilers within Options

[Imogen]

I finished at 4 am and was absolutely thrilled with the whole thing. The books seem to have picked up their magic again after such a shock with book 5.

The H/Gness was perfect, and what's the betting that's going to be resumed in Book 7 at the end - or at least we know the potential is there. And such Harryish reasons for breaking things off. Loved the impromptu kiss in the common room as well, and him wrestling with how Ron was going to react. Totally fantastic to finally see that all happening in the flesh.

As for Snape - my jaw just about dropped! The book obviously belonged to someone slightly dodgy because Hermione kept warning about it all the way through, and it seemed possible it might be Snape (who's obviously adept at potions), but I couldn't work out how he could be the HBP, until I was finally told at the end. We all knew Dumbledore was going to go, but not like that. I never thought Snape would kill him - I honestly thought it would happen with Voldemort.

It certainly looks like Snape has reverted to the dark side, exposing the order. But part of me has to wonder if this is a double bluff on JKR's part. We still don't know why Dumbledore trusted him so much. There's some unfinished business here.

The soul dividing thing makes a lot of sense and provides a nice focus for that last book. The hubby (who has now nabbed my copy) is wondering whether a piece of V's soul might be inside Harry himself. Which would be an interesting twist. I'm looking forward to that last book and seeing how everything wraps up.

Loads of other thoughts are buzzing R/Hness - arguments and that lovely scene at the funeral -, Remus and Tonks, Bill and Fleur (Go Fleur after Bill was bitten, but I loved the Phlegm nickname!) Malfoy and what's going to happen to him now. He couldn't kill Dumbledore, so how is he going to cope as a Death Eater (assuming Voldemort accepts him to take his father's place now), how is Harry finally going to learn to block Snape out of his thoughts.

In a word WOW! Great book. Thoroughly enjoyed it.

Imogen

[Jerry]

Thanks for the quote Drie. I'll try to dissect it. Of course, anyone who wants to reject my explanations and theories is welcome to do so.

Bearing in mind, however, that I believe Snape is innocent, naturally, I'll try to defend him.

1)

QUOTE

Severus Snape kills Dumbledore using ''Avada Kedavra,'' a you-gotta-mean-it-for-it-to-work Unforgivable Curse.

Avada Kedavra needs hatred for it to work. There's no doubt about that. But it may not have been directed at Dumbledore. It may have been directed at Voldemort, or at Snape himself. I don't believe that it says anywhere that Avada Kedavra has to be directed at someone specific. What I think is a clear proof to this theory is the fact that, at the end of OoTP, Voldemort sends a killing curse at Dumbledore, yet Fawkes "dies" (or becomes a baby phoenix once more, as Fawkes can't die.) when he intercepts it. In any case, I don't think Avada Kedavra has to be aimed at something specific. If you have the power and necessary hatred, you can point your wand at a tree, say the words, and the tree will be reduced to sawdust, IMHO. Keeping that fact in mind, we can attempt to say that the hatred was directed at Voldemort, that, indirectly, caused Snape to kill Dumbledore. ("Indirectly" = the fact that Voldemort placed upon Draco to kill Dumbledore, and Snape was forced to perform an Unbreakable Vow, lest Bellatrix (and possibly Narcissa) would become even more suspicious of him. And in the end, under the Vow, Snape needed to kill Dumbledore.) Or we can say that Snape is filled with self-loathing because of the deed that he needs now to do. In either case, the text in the book supports the claim that he contained hatred - "Snape gazed for a moment at Dumbledore, and there was revulsion and hatred etched in the harsh lines of his face." - what the hatred was directed at is a matter of speculation.
Therefore, I agree with EW's quote:

QUOTE

Snape must fulfill his do-or-die Unbreakable Vow to protect Dumbledore's would-be assassin, Draco Malfoy — preserving his cover as a double agent. So he reluctantly kills the Hogwarts headmaster only to continue spying on Voldemort for the Order of the Phoenix.

Actually, thinking along these lines lead me to think: Maybe Avada Kedavra works in the form of crumpling and instantly killing its victims only when its directed at its target, but if it hits an indirect target, it shatters, explodes, and erupts? Everywhere in the book (everywhere I looked, at least) where it recorded a properly-aimed Avada Kedavra, the victim crumpled and died - Frank Bryce, Cedric, the fake Moody's spider, Sirius, But when Voldemort aimed it at Dumbledore (in OoTP) and hit Fawkes and the security guard's desk instead, they burst into flame. Maybe it's the same with Snape and Dumbledore. The hatred fueling the curse wasn't really intended for Dumbledore, so maybe that's why he was blasted into the air... Unlikely, I know. (And logically, it should be the opposite, if you think about it) But it's pretty interesting to note. Or maybe it's the fact that Dumbledore is probably the most powerful wizard alive. To transform this magical 'powerhouse' into nothing (in other words, to kill Dumbledore), it takes a great deal of blasts, eruptions, etc and it won't be taken down quietly....

2)

QUOTE

Once a Voldemort-lovin', half-blood-hatin' Death Eater, always a Voldemort-lovin', half-blood-hatin' Death Eater.

Interesting. But a weak argument, IMHO. Two clear exceptions that I think I identified correctly are Regulus Black and Peter Pettigrew; the former backing out at the last minute, and the latter being what Voldemort himself considers someone who's loyalty wavered. (First chapter in GoF, IIRC)

3)

QUOTE

Dumbledore was ordering Snape to kill him, not begging for his life. He'd never beg!

Quite correct, IMHO. Dumbledore doesn't beg. It's just not him.
To clarify, I want to first say that I've rejected three of my previous theories: 1) that Dumbledore became a horcrux; 2) that Dumbledore said, "Sever us, please"; and 3) that R.A.B. is still alive.
I now think that the potion was simply a lethal drink, but only after a certain amount of time. Dumbledore himself thinks so - "I'm sorry, Harry; I should have said, he would not want to immediately kill the person who reached this island."
Dumbledore knew he wouldn't last long after drinking the potion. He was on his deathbed since the first sip. But that's why he wanted Snape to kill him. He knew that if he would die, Draco would fail in his mission. Meaning that Snape would die, via the Unbreakable Vow. Dumbledore realized that he was going to die that night anyway, why not make it as if Snape killed him? It would accomplish a number of things: It would prevent Draco from being a murderer. it would keep Snape's cover; it would stop Dumbledore's obvious agony that he's in, since when he drank that potion. Also, this brings back the point of "Snape gazed for a moment at Dumbledore" - he gazed at him, using Legilimency. And he read Dumbledore's mind that he wants to be killed by Snape. So that's what Snape did.

4)

QUOTE

He's a master of Occlumency, the ''magical defense of the mind against external penetration.'' Few can see through his lies.

Dumbledore, anyone?

5)

QUOTE

Despite ''trusting'' Snape, Dumbledore refrains from appointing his former pupil Professor of Defense Against the Dark Arts for years. The second he gets the job? Death all around.

I don't have an answer for this yet. All I can attempt to say is "So what, what's the connection?" but I agree that it's a feeble attempt.

6)

QUOTE

Dumbledore admits that being ''rather cleverer than most men,'' his mistakes are ''correspondingly huger.'' Trusting a man who's betrayed him before? Huge mistake. Harry's been saying it all along.

No offense to Harry, but I'd take Dumbledore's word against anyone's. And I think that what Dumbledore was referring to in his above admission, was the specific fact that he didn't tell Harry about the Prophecy and his destiny up until last year, not that he may have made a mistake in trusting somebody or not.

7)

QUOTE

Even while battling Harry, Snape reminds him to ''keep your mouth shut and your mind closed'' - sound advice for his former Occlumency pupil. Plus, Snape has rescued Harry several times, however begrudgingly, and even tells the Death Eaters in book 6 to hold off on killing him, supposedly under Voldemort's ''orders.''

I couldn't have said it any better.

And, finally:
8)

QUOTE

Dumbledore trusts him ''completely.'' That's good enough for us.

And for me, too.

Again, these are just my thoughts. Please feel free to interpret the respective scenarios differently.

Thanks for the interview, Hershey.

This post has been edited by Jerry: Jul 28 2005, 03:56 AM